Radio Birdman & Died Pretty Reflect On The Good Ol' Times And What's Coming Next

In the annals of Australian rock'n'roll you don't get too many bigger names than legendary outfits Radio Birdman and Died Pretty. Both bands forged unique and groundbreaking careers at a time when there were no real antecedents for what they were doing, blasting into their own orbits with only incendiary and atmospheric music (respectively) as their guide.

Now both bands are turning back the clock and teaming up for a co-headlining national tour, and while their actual careers may not have physically crossed over - Radio Birdman's original tenure lasted between 1974 and 1978 while Died Pretty didn't kick into life until 1983 - there was still plenty of overlap in the distinguished pathways they would eventually travel.

Speaking to the bands' respective frontmen in Rob Younger and Ron Peno, The Music starts by transporting back to the legendary days in the late-'70s when Radio Birdman were running their own Darlinghurst venue which they'd christened Oxford Funhouse (name-checking The Stooges, naturally). Peno's first band The Hellcats supported Birdman a few times in this era, a pretty heady start to one's career no matter how you look at it.

Do you remember supporting Radio Birdman in The Hellcats, Ron?

Ron Peno: Yeah, we played some shows with Birdman. They took us under their wing and we played quite a few shows with them. I think The Hellcats only lasted about three or four months, but in that time we played shows with Radio Birdman, yeah.

Rob Younger: You made your mark.

Ron, you can also be spotted in the crowd at a Birdman gig in a still from soon-to-be-released Birdman documentary Descent Into The Maelstrom, did you go and see them often as a punter?

RP: Yes, as many times as I could. I was a huge fan.

RY: There was nothing else to do, Ron.

RP: It was special seeing them in full flight, they were a fantastic band and I loved to go and see them. It was very exciting and wild and heady and great.

RY: And you don't have to pay this time either.

RP: No, I'm getting paid this time too, which is even better.

RY: What?

RP: It's only a small amount

RY: Oh well, that'll keep me in grog for a couple of weeks.

Legend has it that, Rob, you were actually Died Pretty's first ever drummer, can you tell me your recollections of that particular experience?

RY: I seem to recall - I don't even know if it was just twice - but I remember going along to some little space. I think they used to keep mushroom spore in there or something, it wasn't an actual rehearsal room but they tried to clean it out and make space for people to make some racket in there. I guess they didn't have a drummer at the time and wanted to go through some songs. I've always wanted to be decent on the drums but actually I'm not - and I certainly wasn't back then - but I must have tapped away and someone remembered it, so thereafter I've always been the original drummer.

RP: You were the original drummer, Rob.

RY: They were a little bit sloppy and I tried to keep them in time, but it wasn't easy and I'd get shot down: 'Yeah, yeah, Younger, shut up. Next song'.

RP: We were pretty sloppy back then, that much is true.

RY: Yeah, but I could see the genius that was latent at the time.

RP: Latent Genius, there's our next album title.

You can't really hear much direct Radio Birdman influence in Died Pretty's actual music but their shadow looms large over the band, even if only because Younger would eventually produce not only their first single (1984's Out Of The Unknown) but also their first EP (1985's Next To Nothing) and their first two albums (1986's Free Dirt and 1988's Lost).

RP: Very much so, I was always very influenced by Radio Birdman. And still am, and always will be.

RY: Died Pretty doesn't sound anything like Radio Birdman though; the reason I was involved in it was being a mutual friend and being associated with their manager too, John Needham. But I also fell into that because [at the time] I was one of the few people around who had actually been in a band that had made a record in that scene. So suddenly it was, like, 'Hey, you could produce our record!' and that's how it all started.

With the Died Pretty recordings I was just learning on the spot really, and just judging the performances in the studio more than arranging the songs and pulling all that stuff apart. My level of involvement wasn't like that and I wouldn't have had the confidence anyway. Mind you, none of those songs needed much done to them really, it just needed a good performance. The band had so much personality and such a great sense of atmosphere. And a great melodic sense as well, so it was a really good group and I was lucky to hook up with that because it got me other work as well.

Ron, what are your memories of Rob's production skills?

RY: He's unlikely to remember anything.

RP: No, it's murky. It was just a lot of fun basically.

RY: I was mainly just trying to keep the band out of the kitchen where all the beer was.

RP: Rubbish.

RY: Well, go on, answer the question then; what were your impressions of me? I remember you being quite obnoxious, I'd ask you to do something and you'd just walk off.

RP: Nothing much as changed.

RY: I'd ask you to re-do a certain line or something like that and you'd get your back up. You might have been right but I was the producer and I was supposed to hold sway there.

RP: It worked out well anyhow.

So Rob you were more picking the best takes rather than the traditional producer's role?

RY: Yeah, they arranged their songs very well. I suppose Brett [Myers - guitarist and co-songwriter] had a hell of a lot to say about all of that.

RP: Yeah, he did, which was a good thing. Yeah, of course.

So were you mainly trying to get Died Pretty's live sound on tape, or was there more to it than that?

RY: We were trying to get live takes, and kept as much as we could and that's what does actually appear on the records. There's obviously some vocal overdubs and a few guitars here and there but generally it's one or two takes - they might have gone to three on some songs - but I can recall on songs like [1987 single] Winterland, for instance, we used the second take on that one and that was good enough, it was a wonderful performance. We used to just plough along that way; we had limited time and limited money, but the band was great and they had good songs. Fantastic songs, actually.

Did you guys cross paths often after that? Did [Younger's post-Birdman outfit] New Christs and Died Pretty play together much?
RP: Yeah, we did a few shows together.

RY: Yeah I can think of a few, one at Leichardt and a few on the [Sydney] north side here and there.

RP: Actually our first show was supposed to be with you guys, at the Middle Harbour Skiff Club, but you didn't turn up.

RY: We did turn up!

RP: No, you didn't.

RY: I was there, I actually had laryngitis or something and stormed off.

RP: You came down with something and ourselves and Zulu Rattle were left to fight it out over who was going on first and who was going on second. That was our first show and I think it was Zulu Rattle's first show too, so we just said that we'll go on first because we've only got a handful of songs.

RY: In these circumstances, Ron, is where you find a band's character. You might not have recognised it at the time but that might have been a pivotal moment in your career, you should be thanking me now.

RP: No, I probably didn't recognise that but thank you so much Rob. For not turning up to the Middle Harbour Skiff Club.

RY: I turned up, I just told you! I stormed off because nothing was coming out of my mouth because I had laryngitis. My voice was rooted.

RP: Okay, that must have been at the soundcheck.

RY: I stormed off the stage and bashed down the door to what I thought was the dressing room...

RP: That's unlike you!

RY: ...and it turned out it was the bloody kitchen and there's three middle-aged ladies in there preparing chips and stuff!

RP: You monster!

RY: I looked around and realised that I'd made an asshole of myself to the people out in the room and then also to these ladies in the kitchen.

RP: Not a good night?

RY: Not overly, no.

In the intervening years did your cross paths much, or did you keep in touch?

RP: Occasionally, yeah.

RY: Yeah, of course.

The only time I can recall seeing you guys play together was at the inaugural Dig It Up! bash at the Enmore Theatre in Sydney [back in 2012] when a Birdman offshoot Tek & Younger played just before Died Pretty.

RY: Oh yeah, that was a crappy show by us. As I say, 'We excelled that night, it was wonderful. What a magic evening'. I was there to see Redd Kross actually, I loved them.

What about the impetus for this current tour, is there any specific reason that the two bands are doing this together now?

RY: I can't think of one.

RP: I think it was just an idea that maybe John Needham, our manager, had. We share the same manager and I think he kicked something into action.

RY: I do recall saying several months ago that I wanted to have something to do because we weren't going overseas this year or anything like that so maybe that's what spurred it, but I wouldn't want to take any credit for John being on top of his game. But I'm glad there is something coming up, it should be good. I wish we could carry on and go around the world.

RP: That would be wonderful.

RY: Maybe another time. Mind you going around the world with the Died Pretty might be more than we could handle ourselves. Died Pretty on the road is like The Rolling Stones and Led Zeppelin without the money. Their behaviour is appalling, John Needham has told me in minute detail about the things that used to go on when they toured Europe and so forth, and I was incredibly impressed.

RP: Rock'n'roll.

RY: It's nothing I can relate to you now though in a family publication.

What about the fact that the bands are rotating the headlining spot on this run, is that just a matter of diplomacy to save ego clashes and fights?

RP: Of course it is, what do you think?

RY: It is, although I don't know who thought that up.

RP: Not me.

RY: I thought we were going to be supporting them when we heard the idea...

RP: And we thought the same.

RY: ...so it's alternating, yeah. In Melbourne there's two gigs so we switch supports. And there's great supports too, I'm looking forward to catching up with Kim [Salmon] and Dave [Graney] and all that lot too, they're always doing something good. And Mick [Medew] up in Brisbane. It's going to be rocking.

Both of you have current outfits - Ron you've got The Superstitions and the New Christs are still going strong - do you like looking backwards like this or is it more for the fans?

RY: Oh, it's a mixture of all of that. It's good to have something to do and it's good to get out and play those songs again and get together with your mates and do all that sort of thing. Plus you've got a network of friends around the country and stuff so you hook up with them - there's all sorts of reasons. We make a bit of bread out of it, it's good. But yeah we've both got our own bands - Ron's got the Superstitions, who are a great group, and I've been in various line-ups of the New Christs over the years which I love.

Ron, I recently heard some mixes of the original recordings by [his Brisbane band from the early-'80s] The 31^st which are about to be released for the first time.

RP: Yes, well I was consulted about it and said, 'Yeah, whatever'. We only ever recorded four songs, so if somebody wants to release them that's fine. I'm hardly going to make any money out of it, so it's more of a curio thing for people - Died Pretty fans maybe. I haven't heard the recordings yet so I'm not sure yet really.

RY: There were some great players in that group, Ronnie. Apart from yourself, Brad Shepherd was in that band...

RP: Well he wasn't on that recording.

RY: Oh, really? Who plays guitar on that?

RP: Micky Medew.

RY: Oh Mick does all that, he was in there too. What a great aggregation of people.

And Rob, the Birdman doco [Descent Into The Maelstrom] we mentioned earlier is out soon too, are you excited about that?

RY: I don't whether to be excited about it or not. The screening's on tomorrow night. I get a little bit precious and self-conscious about interviews - especially filmed ones and so forth - and I just want to be happy in the knowledge that I came off okay, and I really don't know if that's the case yet. But I think the band will be well-represented. The guy Jonathan Sequeira who directed it is really on the case and put a lot of himself into this, and people assure me that a lot of good people are involved. I'm sure it will be fine. I want to come off looking good myself, that's the main thing, that way I can swan around the place.

Are you glad on some level that the band and its history is being properly documented or happy with the legacy as it is?
RY: I'm not happy with the term 'legacy', I'm never comfortable with that. I'm never sure what it's supposed to mean, especially being the person that it's about. But the documentary has got footage from way, way back and has got interviews with everyone in the band and all the people that were very close to the band: ex-managers, people that came to the gigs and stuff like that - ex-members, for that matter - and all those perspectives are going to be thrown into the middle of it. There's some footage from a recent tour of Europe, Jonathan shot a few shows around France and is going to throw that in there.

I hope it's exciting. It's about a rock'n'roll band so I want it to be a pretty bangin' documentary, and I hope it is from that point of view. I don't want some po-faced analysis or overview thing. I don't think it will be like that, but that would be a concern if it was.